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Legislative Assembly for the ACT: 1996 Week 7 Hansard (19 June) . . Page.. 1888 ..

MR WOOD (12.40): What should be supported is the amendment moved by Mr Whitecross. It more accurately expresses where condemnation should lie in this debate today. Mrs Carnell has made a great deal of this issue. In question time yesterday, she used some strong words. She was talking about "a scandal". Today she or Mr Humphries used the word "deception" and said that there was some plot to doctor figures. In fact, no speaker from the Government has pursued that theme very strongly. They have tended to dance around it, to make imputations, to make suggestions. But Mrs Carnell has certainly endeavoured to make a great deal out of this issue. There is nothing behind it. As Mr Whitecross says, it is tissue-thin. There is nothing there.

It has already been explained to the Assembly that the actual motion, moved rather reluctantly by Mr Humphries, would fail simply on any basis of logic, because Mr Berry did not mislead the Assembly. To take it as far as possible beyond logic, how could asking a question mislead the Assembly? It is nonsense. Let us try to develop a scenario of what happened here. Some time ago, in late 1993, apparently - and we still do not know the full story - figures were doubled up in November 1993, and that went on until December 1994, when, apparently, the department caught up with it. Mrs Carnell then continued to work off those figures in certain respects. Mr Berry never used those figures.

Let us have a look at this. Mr Humphries tried hard to say that Mr Berry has absolute, hands-on responsibility for these figures; that they are his; and that he is condemned by them. Like Mrs Carnell, Mr Berry is not slow to make a political point. He is not at all tardy in putting out a media release. I think they match each other fairly well in that respect. On the paperwork that Mrs Carnell gave us yesterday, there is a clear increase - a doubling of the figures. If Mr Berry had even known about those figures, if he had used those figures, if he had wanted those figures, he would certainly have put out a media statement. He would have been out there in front of the television cameras saying, "Look what our administration has done".

Mr Kaine: He did just that.

MR WOOD: No, he did not. Mr Berry did not use those figures. He says that he did not know about them. They were down there in that department - - -

Members interjected.

MR WOOD: What about your rules, Mr Speaker?

MR SPEAKER: Indeed; I am happy to uphold them. Keep going.

MR WOOD: So, the figures were not used. Mr Humphries acknowledged that they were not tabled in this Assembly. We have nothing coming back to us. The Government, no doubt, has been searching through all the records and, if Mr Berry's name was attached to any of them, they would have been tabled. We do not have them. Mrs Carnell, in new formats, used these figures for a long time. It was not until Mr Berry put out a media statement a little while ago that some questions started to be asked. So that is the story.

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