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Legislative Assembly for the ACT: 1996 Week 7 Hansard (19 June) . . Page.. 1867 ..

MR HUMPHRIES (continuing):

The defence that Mr Berry is putting forward is, "I am not responsible for those figures because, although I used them frequently in this place to claim that there was an increase in throughput, although I claimed that repeatedly in this place, although I have made much capital out of that fact and although I did that frequently, I never actually tabled the figures in this place". That is a claim which I do not believe is sustainable, because Mr Berry relied upon the figures. He relied upon them in this place. He made assertions based on them in this place, and did so yesterday.

Okay, forget everything that happened before yesterday and after Mr Berry ceased to be Minister for Health; forget all of that if you want to. Yesterday, in this place, Mr Berry repeated in his supplementary question the allegation that there were 2,000 people who had not had operations in our hospital system that they were supposed to have. Mr Berry repeated the assertion that there had been a decline in the number of people receiving treatment in our public hospital system. He now, I think, concedes that that statement was not true. It was not true. In fact, the number of people waiting for operations has decreased under this Government, and the waiting list has fallen under this Government. That is the fact. Mr Berry wants a briefing, but he will not be prepared to accept the evidence that comes from that briefing. The fact is that that is true.

Mr Whitecross: He is not accepting any allegation from you.

MR HUMPHRIES: What I have said is true. There are more people who have had operations as a result of Mrs Carnell's reforms; there has been a decrease in the hospital waiting list under Mrs Carnell; and there have been 3,749 operations recorded by Mr Berry which did not take place.

I ask members to support this motion of censure because Mr Berry has always been ready to point the finger of censure at other people in this place. He has moved such motions in this place. He has always been quick to accuse people, as I have quoted before, of creating an atmosphere in this place where a different impression is attempted to be created to what the truth, in fact, is. Tabling information in a particular form has never been of itself a matter for, necessarily, censuring a member in this place; but relying upon it when they know it to be wrong, to create an impression which is false, certainly has been a matter deserving of censure in this place. Indeed, Mr Berry himself has moved such motions successfully in this place. He censured Mrs Carnell earlier this year on that very basis - that she tabled figures that turned out not to be accurate and she was responsible for those figures because she had produced those figures. Exactly that test now hoists Mr Berry on his own very high standard in these matters, and he ought to accept that he is deserving of censure by this place for misleading it repeatedly as to those phantom operations carried out in the public hospital system while he was Minister for Health.

MS FOLLETT (11.27): Mr Speaker, I rise to defend Mr Berry on this matter, and I do so in utter amazement that Mrs Carnell, the Minister for Health and Community Care, is apparently not even now prepared to get up and put her case. Not even at this stage in the course of the debate has Mrs Carnell been able to produce one shred of evidence to support her public statements. That is a disgrace.

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