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Legislative Assembly for the ACT: 1996 Week 1 Hansard (21 February) . . Page.. 138 ..

MS FOLLETT (continuing):

A second fraudulent argument put forward by the Government was that in some fashion the CPSU had encouraged Mrs Carnell to take this action. This is untrue. The fact of the matter is that the CPSU was attempting to protect itself and its members from the typical actions of Liberal governments that they have seen previously to abolish payroll deductions and - - -

Mrs Carnell: We were not abolishing payroll deductions. That is a lie.

MS FOLLETT: That is what they thought this Government was about. The CPSU, unlike the Government, know their history.

Mr Berry: On a point of order, Mr Speaker: I think that statement by Mrs Carnell should be withdrawn.

Mrs Carnell: I will change it to "a fraudulent claim".

MR SPEAKER: Thank you.

Mr Berry: She has to withdraw the other.

MS FOLLETT: Did I hear a withdrawal?

Mrs Carnell: I changed it to "a fraudulent claim".

MS FOLLETT: You either withdraw it or you do not.

Mr Berry: I do not want to get into a debate about this, Mr Speaker.

MR SPEAKER: I do not either. Just withdraw it, Chief Minister. You did withdraw the word "lie"?

Mrs Carnell: Yes, I did, and I substituted - - -

Mr Berry: Most of us have to rise to our feet when we speak, Mr Speaker. It is hard to tell.

MR SPEAKER: Continue, Ms Follett.

MS FOLLETT: The CPSU know their history. They know what Liberal governments have tried to do to them in the past. They remember the Fraser days when the then Liberal Government, in confrontation with the former CPSU union, the ACOA, actually abolished payroll deductions. They remember the impact that had on their membership, on their union activities and on their capacity to protect their members.

In looking for a range of alternative methods to allow members to pay their union dues, the CPSU was attempting to avoid that situation occurring, because they thought it would occur under Mrs Carnell. They saw the circulars of 2 February and 12 February and thought, "We are gone; payroll deduction is gone. This is what happened to us under Fraser, under a previous Liberal government, in Canberra, in this town". It was not until

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