Page 4095 - Week 15 - Thursday, 17 December 1992
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Ambulance Service - Work Futures Contract
MRS CARNELL: My question is to the Minister for Health, Mr Berry. I ask the Minister whether it is normal to employ an external consultant, in this case Work Futures, at a cost to ACT taxpayers of $14,732, to "facilitate processes and mechanisms to further the working relationships" between the ACT Ambulance Service and the Transport Workers Union and to enhance "union consultation and involvement in matters affecting the Ambulance Service".
MR BERRY: Madam Speaker, it is not an everyday occurrence, but it is not uncommon for consultants to be brought in - - -
Mr Kaine: Cannot management talk to trade unions any more?
MR BERRY: Mr Kaine asks, "Cannot management deal with the trade union any more?". Of course they can. It is not normal, but it is not unusual either. In the normal course of events, management deals with trade unions on the industrial relations issues that crop up from day to day.
Mrs Carnell: Is it a particularly difficult union?
MR BERRY: Mrs Carnell says it is a particularly difficult union. There are always two sides to conflict in the industrial sense and sometimes an outsider is needed to reorganise the way that industrial relations occur in the workplace. The involvement of outside consultants to do these sorts of things occurs from time to time. It is about encouraging cooperation between management and unions with a view to continuing with the restructuring and the evolution of a better service for the people of the ACT. I met with the principal of Work Futures as a result of his involvement with the Ambulance Service, and I must say that he impressed me as somebody who could provide the sort of input that was required to deal with some industrial sensitivities which had been identified in the Ambulance Service. My answer, in summary, is no, it is not normal, but it is not uncommon either.
MRS CARNELL: I have a supplementary question, Madam Speaker. I wondered why none of the, I think, three industrial relations areas within ACT Government already could not do the job, and why the consultancy was not put out to tender.
MR BERRY: I think that, when it comes down to these sorts of consultancies, first, it is a low cost one. It is $13,000 - - -
Mr Kaine: Close to $15,000. It is not much, I know.
MR BERRY: Okay, $15,000. Management have a look around to see who can best do the job and what price options are available.
Mr Kaine: They are supposed to get three quotes.
MR BERRY: The real issue is whether you get the job done or not and whether you get the - - -
Mr De Domenico: No, the process is important too.
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