Page 6098 - Week 18 - Thursday, 12 December 1991
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1976, which was not done; and that leaves us now with a difficult situation. I do not think Australia should ever condone, or be seen to be condoning, wanton murder of innocent people in any country.
Mr Collaery: We are when we sell their oil. They are a poor people.
MR STEFANIAK: There are a couple of other things too, Bernard.
Mr Collaery: It does not matter, mate; it is a disgrace.
MR STEFANIAK: I am supporting you, Bernard. It behoves us as a civilised country to be very vocal and active in terms of opposing oppression wherever it be, be it on our doorstep, in East Timor, or anywhere else.
One of the best ways of opposing aggression, in fact the only way of ensuring that we do not fall into the trap of appeasement, is to give a clear indication to foreign powers that we can stand up for our rights; that we will look after our interests and we will, if need be, exercise our responsibility, as part of a civilised world community, to join with other countries in using force against aggressors.
I would remind Mr Collaery, who has some noble sentiments in this area - I sympathise greatly with what he is saying - that if he is really serious about opposing appeasement there is one sure way of doing that. I think the West has learnt a lot since the dreadful days of the 1930s when the West disarmed, but the aggressors in Nazi Germany, fascist Japan, fascist Italy and Soviet Russia did not, and just walked all over the West.
There is only one way to stand up to a bully, and that is to counter force with force. That means, in terms of this country, that we need a strong defence force. I think a lot more can be done, by the Federal Labor Government and, indeed, by my own party, federally, in relation to that. That is the only sure-fire way to counter aggression. People poke a lot of fun at Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher; but, because of those two politicians especially, the West was able to stand up to a Soviet Union that was rearming.
Mr Collaery: We are not standing up to Indonesia, and we have to get some guts.
MR STEFANIAK: Well, we are not standing up to Indonesia, Bernard. We do not have a terribly good record there in that regard or, indeed, in some other regards, over a number of years. What I am pointing out to you is that the only sure way of standing up to aggression is by matching force with force. That is an unfortunate fact of life.
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